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Discussion Starter #1
Finally this winter I am having Blue-car, my 69 ragtop resprayed. Luckily I found the perfect painter to do it. They are doing a proper job, removing all trim, stripping to bare metal, using only Glasurit paint, etc. (my dream come true for Blue-car...)


Couple of questions. He isn't an RR specialist, but a Classic car paint expert. But we both want to do a job as RR would do it.

How should we have the door jambs done? does anyone know how they did the painting at Park Ward's in 69? Did they paint the car body with the doors off, and paint the jambs at the same time as painting the rest of the car? Or did they do the jambs separately (ahead of time), then mask them off, then put the doors on, then spray?

Was the any tape line, or any visible transition between the door jamb painting and the rest of the car?

My car has had both rear quarters resprayed so I can't go by what is there.

If I were to do it in an improper manner would the value of the car be effected? (He said he could use a special type of "no line" tape, maybe foam take I don't know). I don't want to go through the whole thing and do it in a way that will be visibly wrong...

I sort of wish there was a way to do it properly with the doors on but I doubt that's how it was done. But who knows? Maybe someone here...

Then I have to decide on the colour! The car is silver mink exterior with blue everflex convertible top, and 3209 blue vaumol interior. As built. Everyone says to keep the original colour, which I do like. They made 18 of them with this exterior colour. But I could have any colour I want. I love black, but many folks say black cars with blue leather are not common and may be a liability. (of course I'd like to change the interior to red, and black exterior is ideal for that). but the interior is almost perfect condition and changing it just for colour is silly.

What do you guys think. Is silver mink good enough? I am not wasting a paint job if I keep that colour? (everyone says they love it, but they are comparing it to the beige hyundai next to it). I like the colour fine, but it doesn't particularly show the chrome off very well. Of course now it is faded, so it doesn't show the curves of the car well either. I just don't want to find out afterwards that I painted it the wrong colour. I had a death in my family and I though painting the car black was an appropriate tribute, but the man who died hated black, so I don't want to do something for him that he would hate. (don't say that doesn't matter) Anyway that was one excuse why to paint it black. There are probably lots of black ragtops extant. My ideal is mason's black, black top, with 3171 red interior. but I don't have money to change the interior and the top (which is only 2 years old). The paint is getting done now because it is needed, and the guy who will do it isn't gonna live forever. If I don't get a better idea it will just be silver mink again. a little on the aquamarine side, like it came with. some formulas of silver mink are just plain silver, I am not getting that.

Any help or ideas are appreciated. Especially on the door jamb painting thing.

Schmitt's had a car similar for sale last year, although it was photographed under phony lighting and doesn't resemble the colour as it looks outside (which is much better). And that car also has a tan top which doesn't compliment the car very well. Silver mink usually was done with a dark blue top.

https://www.schmitt.com/inventory/1969-rolls-royce-silver-shadow-convertible-by-mulliner-park-ward/
 

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I did a total strip down of my 1980 SWII. I can help answer questions regarding trim removal, some of it can be tricky. Stripping the door jambs and doors can be time con$uming. Best to use a primer-sealer and spray with the final color. Doors and then shut and use a "foam tape" just inside the door gap.
Will the painter use a single or 2 stage paint?
 

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Black and blue in my opinion looks wrong, but that's just me. I would agree with what everyone else is telling you. Stay with original colors. Especially given the effort you're going through as you'll never be able to cover all the original paint unless you strip the shell down completely.

As far as how to? However the painter wants to as he's the expert and having him do something differently to what he does usually won't 'improve' things.

Technology has moved on since the 60's and there are new paint systems available. I suspect that metal etch primer was used before followed by primer and paint. These days , most people would use an epoxy primer to seal the metal before applying primer and paint. Removing and dissembling the doors , trunk and hood and painting them all separately will give you the finish you're looking for.

Single stage can be used for solid colors, but base/clear for metallic. Again, whatever the painter is used to using is what you should go with.
 

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Hi,


You have to do it properly or you will lose it's value.


Screen OUT, doors off, window frames out, bonnet off, boot off and all rubbers removed etc etc.


Patterned outer rubbers for door/window frame replacements are not good and I don't know if any originals are able to be got for a corniche but if you short cut it will look like the picture in no time at all. Just the mention of 'lining tape' or 'foam in shut lines' would put me off. The only time lining tape would be needed would be if you intended a dual colour.


Prep, prep, prep and more prep and it is costly but worth the expense.


Also when trim removed make sure it is not allowed to be stored badly as permanent indents will be made in the surfaces if anything is put on top of it or leather parts put in contact with each other can cause damage.



Just my opinion
 

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Foam tape is not for 2-color exterior paint jobs.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
thanks for the help guys...

ok so in any case, they are not going to do two colours, no 2 tone. I am 99% sure the car will just be original colour which is silver mink. It has a dark blue everflex ragtop and vm3209 dark blue leather. It's just slightly intriguing to have a choice, as this is the only time in my lifetime I will ever choose the colour of any Rolls Royce of my own.


I don't want to do this job at all if it isn't going to be correct, that is, the way the factory did it. The only thing I am doing "wrong" is I am not using lacquer paints. I am using "Glasurit 55 Line" catalyzed solvent borne urethane paints. Since it is metallic it is going to have clear coat on top of base coat. The whole car stripped to bare metal, all trim, parts, all rubber removed. Metal will be cleaned with the metal prep solvent that glasurit specifies for their primer, then we will use glasurit Chromated Epoxy primer, which is the best epoxy there is, (and being discontinued next year due to 4 of the heavy metal poisons it has in it). ($525 for a 3.5L can of primer and the hardner for it.)

So I have a pretty fair idea how to do it. I got a 1,000 page textbook, and researched about 100 hours online.

The question comes to how they did the masking in the factory and how the doors were painted, either on the car or off of it? The job will take 5 months, and this is a long time coming. I don't want it to look like a mercenary dealer respray like 70% of the Corniches seem to be these days. Besides that, it is my only car, it has to last a long time.

I am unsure how to remove the chrome trim at the beltline, I suppose I will only find out after the glass is all out. this is very different than the 4 door shadows.

I will need to buy a new rubber seal for the windscreen; do I need to buy Genuine for this or is the Introcar the same thing in a different box? Someone mentioned the repro rubber parts not being good. (the 2 door windscreen is different shape than the regular shadow screen, so takes a different rubber gasket). When I got a repro replacement trunk seal from Replacement parts, it looked ok but never fit right. Not sure what to do about that, will do something else with that. Maybe update the trunk seal to the newer type.

One thing I am doing for sure is having the fender holes filled, where they had the rear view mirrors mounted directly above the front wheel arches. I took those mirrors off 15 years ago and put chrome buttons in those holes. That was the "elephant ear" type mirrors you see in some 66-69 shadows. At least on this year car, there was a provision for a side door mirrors without drilling into the doors, and I was able to get NOS 1969 door mirrors.

And I am having the european license plate mounting holes welded up because for the time being I am only going to use it in the USA, where license plates are only half the proper width (and too tall as well).

And I will need to unfasten the top from the rear deck of the car so they can strip and paint all the metal there.
 

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You will find how to remove the trim and everything else for that matter in the FSM. The leading edge of the belt trim is held with a "shoe" that has a stud. The shoe slides into the trim strip and is secured by a nut on the shoes' stud. Access is eith from the fender well with the inner fenders removed or thru the headlamps once they are removed. The rear of the trim is usually held with a visible nut in the door jamb. The trim is held with plastic retainers and will likely need to be replaced. There is a plastic retainer that is inserted into the body, retainers are then slid into the channel, and then lined up and pushed to adhere.
You will need many of these and suggest looking at the Flying Spares website to see what you're dealing with.
I had no issues with the front windscreen gasket from Replacement Parts. The door seals held by a channel on the door with no adhesive.
 

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Foam tape is not for 2-color exterior paint jobs.

Wow that took some 'word smithing' to come up with that twisted false fake comment.


No one used the word foam tape......read read read read.


Lining tape IS used to do dual colours which is what I said. It simply creates a much sharper definitive line unlike masking tape where the paint can creep through as the glue is not uniform and varies by its 'TACK' rating



Foam in shut gaps is used generally in minor repairs where it is not worth the strip down of major panels. It prevents the paint from creating a solid line similar to what is termed 'back masking'. The thought of discussing a bare metal respray where foam in shut gaps was mentioned would ring bells as 'NO EXPERIENCE' 'COWBOY' and many other terms.


Avoid twisting words in an effort to make diatribe comments:roll:


Steve....who had his own bodyshop, paintshop, trim shop and workshops at Jaguar/AM and built all engineering prototypes.
 

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The leading edge of the belt trim is held with a "shoe" that has a stud. The shoe slides into the trim strip and is secured by a nut on the shoes' stud. Access is eith from the fender well with the inner fenders removed or thru the headlamps once they are removed. The rear of the trim is usually held with a visible nut in the door jamb. The trim is held with plastic retainers and will likely need to be replaced. There is a plastic retainer that is inserted into the body, retainers are then slid into the channel, and then lined up and pushed to adhere.
You will need many of these and suggest looking at the Flying Spares website to see what you're dealing with.



Very misleading IMHO the Corniche only has the lower cill/rocker and bonnet trim held in with the plastic cups and clips. So nowhere near the amount of trim clips needed. There is a metal retention clip on all 3 strips that has a 2ba nut that has to be removed. The front bonnet nut is accessed easier when bonnet has been removed and best trim replaced after paint before bonnet refit otherwise very difficult to access that nut.


You would need a very looooooonnnnnggg arm to get to any trim nut on a Corniche through the headlamp fitting:D:eek:



The lower finishers you do have to get to the front nut, but there should be a small aluminium plate cover screwed onto the rear lower of the fibreglass wheelarch liner which providing you have small hands can just get into remove it.


Personally whilst a pain I would remove the front wheel arch liners as it will make welding up the wing mirror holes much easier.




Steve........who reads what people say:devil
 

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Hi,


In response to the specific question whether RR painted the bare body shell in factory with doors on or off I suspect it was with doors ON as when I repainted my car there was no paint underneath the hinges.


That aside to do a bare metal respray properly you really do need to take the doors OFF just to nicely remove all the old paint.


Different auto companies however had various methods of dealing with the paint process. Some would do it with doors OFF but run jigs holding the doors alongside the car shell and others would add specific spacers to the door hinges that allowed the doors to rest offset and give more access into the door jamb.


When spraying metallic it is very important to have the panels in the correct orientation to the matching panel. My car was a solid colour so the doors were painted totally separately.


Metallic paints however rely on the small particles in the paint being applied in same direction and orientation otherwise despite being the same paint from the same tin can look totally different at various angles. You can see this on many brand new modern cars especially where the front and rear plastic bumpers mate to the body. As these parts are not painted at the same time as the metal body they can at certain angles look a totally different shade.



Hope this helps


Steve
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Thanks Wraithman and Steve.

I suppose from now on I should just call my car a Corniche, even though it is a 69, to avoid the confusion, because as Steve says, there is no belt line trim on these cars (no matter their name, MPW 2 dr. Shadows or from 71 on, Corniche).

I did see the little access panel where the nut is removed from the trim holding stud for the lower sill moulding. As I read it, once that nut is out, and stud removed, the rest of the trim is held by clips, and the back end of the trim in front of the rear wheel arch is a slide in, so once the other clips are removed the trim slides rearward and off the rearmost clip?

Steve, this is very important to me, the metallic can't look like a new car, all screwed up. The guy is a good painter, and knows to make sure the doors are sprayed at same time and in same position as they would be on the car. No doubt they must be removed to get the car and doors stripped properly.

The question comes into play. where we have many applications of coatings, primer, then base, then clear, I don't think I can afford to have him mount and unmount the doors in between all of these phases.

I suppose if the car and doors were painted with the doors off the car, the mounting and unmounting half a dozen times wouldn't be necessary.

Are you suggesting to take the doors off, and treat the car, and it's door jambs, as one big unit, and paint the jambs in the same sessions as the rest of the allover car paint is done? SO, whilst they are painting the rear quarters, and front fenders, (and even doors, mounted on holding fixtures off the car but in the proper orientation, and hood and trunklid), all at once?

Some people do jambs first with a small gun, (cutting in), and then do the rest of the car as a separate session. (this is mind boggling)

But it seems that there will be some improvisation, for example, I don't think the doors can be mounted in such a way that the inner and outer of the doors themselves can be painted at once. Perhaps the inners of the doors should be painted first before the outers and rest of car are done (by inners of doors I mean the painted places of the door that are invisible when the door is on the car with the door closed)

Steve, one more question, if you know, have you seen Corniche cars with original paint and examined the door jambs? Did they finish these areas to the same level as the outside of the car? On mine it looks like some places in the front near the hinges and where the windshield pillar comes down, looks like maybe they finished off some of those areas with a brush, or if not with a brush, at a different time than the rest of the car.

Whilst I am not worried about over-restoring the car (losing points for doing too good a job, I wouldn't care about that, like some american car restorers do), at the same time, I don't want to add 100 hours of labour, trying to do something that even Park Ward's didn't bother to do. I think they painted the car with the doors on, which begs the question, how and when did the jambs get done, and what was used to keep the two sessions of painting from overspraying one another? (perhaps it was as simple as thin coats and lots of polishing, or masking different coats at different places and then polishing, or even brushing some areas around the hinges).

This is what I would love to know, what is the process that Park Ward's used? I believe they were not fired until around 1992 or so, maybe one of them is still alive? I'd be happy to even duplicate the process they used in the last of the Mulliner Park Ward Corniche cars. They shut down MPW around 92 and moved the custom bodies into Crewe as I understand it, shortly after the last P-VI was finished.
 

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Hi,


Corniche is better than 'rag top':)



That is a lot to think about and I will ask my paint specialist as the metallic process has to be more exact.


No problem though painting inner doors or even door jambs first as because they are not really seen 'panel to panel' so the shade variation experienced with metallics will not be the same problem.


Apparently it is to do with the way the metallic particles rest during drying why it is essential to spray mating panels together at the same time.


Just taking the easiest answer albeit you are a long way from this yet probably the cill/sill/rocker trims actually pull forward to remove off the rear body bracket. You have to be careful when removing and indeed even more careful when refitting as the trim has to be slightly angled once the 2BA nut has been removed to clear the clips out of the body to be able to slide the whole trim part forward.


This can cause a bit of internal strain on the inner lip of the trim and you must make sure any sharp edges are tapped back before refitting as the stainless steel is very thin. I always shape a piece of stone chip sticky plastic and fit these to the rear and front too. the rear is essential as it prevents any possibility of scratching the fresh paint when sliding the trim back onto the rear clip.


Also look after the little clip from the front of the bonnet. My painter lost this and FS wanted £35 for a new one. Luckily my friendly RR breaker gave me one.


Will ask a few questions and come back


Steve
 

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Hi,


Well I knew nothing would be easy but picked up the odd interesting tip.


Firstly before actually removing the doors check shut lines are all good and adjust accordingly. Apparently Corniches larger door have a habit of hinge sag. measure the shutline gap at the rear of the door just for reference.



Once all set evenly then all the door trim, glass, frames, handles etc etc should be removed whilst the door is still on the car. When all the weight has been removed, the door measurement should be rechecked at the rear to cill/rocker. This becomes an important measuremet as it will have increased due to the weight loss.


Special simple brackets and supports are then fabricated for the boot and bonnet to lift them up a few inches and slighlty rear for the boot and forward for the bonnet. The brackets must also allow bonnet and boot to be hinged. NOT the doors though they just get fitted back.




All panels then removed and stripping paint is then door with all panels OFF ie boot/bonnet/doors.


All prep and priming body/jambs/doors/bonnet/boot including final primer coat are done with panels OFF.


Bonnet/hood and boot/trunk are then refitted using the stand off brackets, doors are refitted in primer to their original fixings and maintaining the gap measurement prior to removing.


Top coats then applied as required so doors and jambs are done in finished place. Access is gained to boot bonnet interior draining channels as the additional brackets are made and set so channels cleared to allow painting but both bonnet and boot are kept in the typical SHUT position but lifted slightly upward and forward by the additional bracketry for the final top coats.


Hope it at least gives some thoughts and obviously I have no idea how done originally.


Steve
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Another question Steve, and thanks again I really appreciate the help.

Any idea how to take the glass out of the rear quarter window channels? (After I get the windows all out I want to take the brass channels all apart and have them rechromed, but I don't want to break the glass taking it out of the channels. I want to do it with all the side windows actually).

And another subject, how to get the snow pack vents out? Is that easy?

About the door jambs, we may have some leeway, in that even if they were done ahead of time, or even if we painted the car with doors on and closed, I think they have blending solvents, which are made to do repairs right in the middle of a panel and blend it in invisibly. This could be used in a door jamb if a blend had to be made between the outer paint and inner doorjamb paint if the doors were painted on the car after jambs painted beforehand. Just an idea.

Also, how do you deal with metallic settling in the paint gun itself? do you need an agitator built into the gun to continually stir the paint? (if we don't have this, it is a good reason to paint doors, hood, trunk on the car and in order, so the paint comes out of the gun at the right time for the settlement of metalllic). (starting to drive me nuts). I hope getting a good paint job isn't as difficult as getting good leather seats redone, because fully 95% of leather retrims look like pure garbage, like seats inside a Camaro.

Luckily Glasurit had a corresponding code for the Silver Mink so they mixed up a pint of it for us to test, to make sure the colour and shade are what we want. I have seen silver mink I love and silver mink that is not very good, I think it depends on the mix. They charge $236 for a pint of base coat. But at least, if it is wrong shade, I won't have bought 2 gallons of it. (I am making them make extra base coat paint so if the car is wrecked later on it can be fixed without another mix. Hopefully I will have an extra half gallon).

I am sure it will be good in the end but I have a feeling it is gonna be uphill. At least I am not doing too much of the actual work. I will take the car apart and put back together though.

When I did my new top/headliner/padding/rear window/wood forms/ etc, it was supposed to be 60hrs labour, but took me 500. (I had no training, no instructions, no help, and no experience in trim work; combine those with myself being an insane perfectionist, I ended up doing the thing about 7 times, because I wasn't gonna have it look like a car with a "new top"). Those MPW guys were amazing craftsmen. Aside from Richard Gorman's guys I don't know who does stuff like that anymore. I believe my paint guy is in that calibre, 50yrs experience but no expertise with PMC. His helper has 45yrs experience so between the two, 95 years of wisdom ought to be able to do it right. And $2500 of german paint. (preposterous)
 

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The present spray guns are HVLP and the material is gravity fed downward rather than suction from a canister below the gun. There is no agitation at all. The fine metal particle is suspended and when properly mixed there is no issue with "settling"
 

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Hi,
I will try to answer what I can for you.


I have never removed the glass rear windows from the Corniche but I am sure it will be covered in the workshop manual. I have the original manuals complete but they are available on line but will see if any info. I have repaired the window mechanisms and limit switches on the rear mechanisms and would assume yours will be the old Piper ones fitted.
Re snow pack vents....not sure if you mean the two oblong vents at the front and again not sure if you have the ducting to the footwells. Some remove the ducting entirely as did later cars albeit the front outer fittings were left blanked as my car, until finally these were removed too around 1975. The front vent exterior finishers just have a solid lip on one long inner flat surface and two spring clips on the opposite side. I avoid saying top or bottom as I have had them fitted both ways. These can be a pain to remove and very easily damages as they are so thin.
Given you are going to paint the car you can try gently pulling from the front and with a thin spatula locate the clips and push them to allow the finisher to come out but again old clips will likely be rusty and may break. If broken and rotted the clip can actually drop down behind the front panel and I actually then get behind the vents from under the car and push up the clips then the vents just pop out. Again easier if wheel arch liners removed. If they have been fitted the opposite way you may be able to get in from the headlamp aperture. The clips are riveted to the finisher about 5 inches apart and an inch or so from each end just about as the semicircle breaks into the flat part. You may be able to see the head of the rivet from the outside which should help you locate them and see which way round the finisher has been fitted. Do be careful with the finishers the replacements even secondhand are extortionate cost.

Not sure what you mean by the brass parts as the window metal I think is stainless. But explain which parts you are referring to.
Wraithmans covered the metallic paint issue and I agree essential a gravity fed gun. There are lots of additives that get added to the paint to help this and many techniques with each specialist on nozzle spray pattern on how the paint is applied. i do see the sprayers though when spraying metallics give a little upward 'jerk' on the gun whilst spraying.
So many things that will totally be in the hands of the experience of your paint specialist. It is much harder for them even on a bare metal respray as there are still oils and silicones on the car which get into the air and can cause the odd 'fish eye' problem. Also important the whole car body is brought up to even temperature as this again can totally affect the flash off time of the paint which again can cause ghosting appearances seen usually on larger areas. (I hate metallic paint).
Leather reconnollising or dye as it is referred too is not too bad to do and maybe best start a totally new topic for that. So many products available that can fill cracks. Again all down to prep and more prep and you can get a real nice result. The hardest part is if you have contrast piping that is a lot more time consuming. Jaguar/AM and Rolls Royce were undoubtably the best of the rest of the old standards of trimming. I used to get loaned top of the market Fords when I visited headquarters in Michigan. The standard of trim even on the Lincolns was nowhere near the same quality.
I have not managed to do any job in a reasonable time as something else always crops up that might as well be done as well seems to always take time.


Although I might have some odd 'spats' with wraithman his standard of restoration has to be admired...total perfection. I better not call him too an 'insane perfectionist' (your words) but rarely is it seen but always has to be balanced with each individuals long term requirements. I have 3 of my cars in my collection that are still not worth today what they cost me to restore even doing a lot of work myself.


I looked after the prototype bodyshop, small paint area, prototype trim shop and workshops building all the styling concepts into running cars even for motor shows. The skills still are certainly around today but car manufacturers just talk about 'hours per car' (HPC). Jaguars used to be around 30 ish wheras Fords were around 12 HPC. We were always being tasked to reduce HPC but they seemed not to understand we hand made seats and door trims etc whereas they bought in these parts as complete assemblies.


I find today modern metallic cars ie paint does not look as good as it used to years ago. I am sure this is to do with the actual particle size of the 'metallic' in the paint which is something too that can be specified and alter how even metallics of the same theoretical colour can appear.
I am glad my RR car is a solid colour albeit again one of 3 that are red based and that does have its own problems. I did not have mine done either as a base coat and laquer it was just top gloss 2 pack......seen too many paint jobs where the laquer has started coming off. The cost of the paint was high into the 3 approaching 4 figures.
Look forward to seeing yours when completed, but fire away with any other queries.
Steve


here is mine
 

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Hi,


Here is the link to the rear convertible side windows removal and refit from page 58.



http://rrtechnical.info/sy/tsd2476/20.pdf



However the whole document has a lot more that you really need to read as covers various removal of other items too like boot handle lock etc.


Maybe though someone has done this before as there is no substitute for anyone's personal experience. Often workshop manuals work on basis of good parts, and when older other things can crop up on dis-assembly


Hope this helps



Steve
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Lets see the front of your car Steve.

They are using HVLP, Wraithman, and it should save on paint quantity as well.


1. Interesting about the door adjustments and removal of weight likely raising the door settled position. My doors are perfect alignment in all xyz directions. Perhaps I should remove all trim, then put a brick in the door to add back the proper weight, so the bodywork can be done without readjusting the doors to an improper weight. The corniche body gaps are smaller than the shadow, I believe the spec is 3/32. Very little room for wrong adjustment.
2. Do you know of a trick to get the small nut off of the stud of the front trim clip for the rocker/sill moulding? There is an access panel there, but the stud of the trim clip is about 2 inches long and I don’t have any BA sockets that long, nor do I have any crows foot wrenches in BA sizes. I though maybe clamping a BA socket to the end of a screwdriver and using that as a makeshift crows foot. They used to make hollow nut drivers for these fasteners in electricians tools, but they were not BA sizes. I suppose if I got an electricians hollow nut driver in a size too large, perhaps it could be shimmed down or partly filled with epoxy and made to fit the BA nut. any other ideas? Is this a 2BA size? When I put this rocker trim back on, I wish I could eliminate the clips altogether, and attach the trim using 3m trim adhesive tape, the same way trim is attached to new cars. That way I won’t be waiting for the rust to start at the clip locations.


3. When they make the temporary fixtures to hold the bonnet and boot lids up, how high off their regular positions should these be? Are these brackets going to enable the paint to be painted in the areas underneath these lids? IE the jambs? I mean, there is a pretty big channel there surrounding the perimeter bonnet and boot opening. Are these channels meant to be painted with the bonnet and bootlids standing there on the temporary fixtures? Or are these channels meant to be painted ahead of time when the lids are not there? What is the actual purpose of having these bonnet and bood lids standing proud of their regular positions during painting?

4. With regard to “Brass pieces” I read somewhere that the early Corniche side window channels are all brass. Perhaps in 1986 they switched to stainless when the front vent window shape changed. Anyhow on my early car they are definitely chrome plated. I was not always quick enough to keep them clean and there have been some minor dulling of the finish. Looks perfect to a layman, but I’m an insane maniac. Trouble is, they used flat rubber as gaskets between the glass and the channels, and this rubber has turned to a tarlike substance, very sticky. I can’t imagine how to make the glass slide out of there. Perhaps in the oven at 200 degrees for a while? I don’t want to break any of the original glass. This is a special car, arrived to me with 24k original miles, a perfect original interior. With the new top and paint it ought to be pretty near par. If glass is replaced the markings will not match. My idea is to make the car look as if it has all original parts, nothing replaced. I wish the paint could be made to look like acrylic lacquer. I am afraid this new paint job will make the car look like it is repainted no matter how good a job we do, just because urethane looks different than acrylic lacquer. I am using the best possible urethane, in the hope that the final job will have a clarity of image somewhere near that of acrylic lacquer. Unfortunately, good paint companies don't make acrylic lacquer anymore, and the stuff the side companies sell now isn't good quality like what was used originally, which has lasted 50 years on the car. I wish I could do the car in acrylic lacquer but it isn't possible to get quality paint. I don't suppose there are any tricks to do to make the urethane look like lacquer. There was talk of doing the clear coat in two separate sessions, and sanding down the first 2 coats flat, then putting on two more. I don't know if this guy plans on doing that. Some folks say the same look can be accomplished by using one session of clear and then sanding and polishing after all the coats are done.

5. Steve, your car is very nice, what colour is that? Claret? I love the wrap around rear bumpers. (on my car, there is a cone shaped rubber “bumper iron grommet” where the bolt holds the forward leg of the rear bumper to the car. Best price on that is $36 each side, and if it was for a MG it would retail for $1.19, but the MG version is not the right shape. Any idea where to get one of these for less than $40 each? I have seen this exact item on old trucks from the 40s and 50s but can’t remember the model.

6. Mine is a 69, USA spec, so it has the very small sized side marker lights, front and rear. The same size light that the UK cars use for a side turn signal. While I like these tiny lights more than the later large type, they still bastardize the styling somewhat, as the car was designed without them. A 67 has none. I thought about asking the man to weld up the holes for these lights and make the car look like a 67. I suppose if I were forced to sell the car to a buyer who wanted them back I could just drill holes and put them back. I don’t intend to ever sell the car but if I am forced to do so, to buy a medical procedure or something, I don’t want to have ruined the value of the car. (we don’t have actual healthcare in usa, if we get sick we have to sell our cars and houses.

7. I wasn’t keen to do base coat/clear coat but with metallic they say I will have much more thickness available for polishing in future. I had cars where the clear coat came off. In those days some factories were using two different types of paint that never should have been used together. On this job they will spray the clear on the colour before the colour is fully cured. (it is two pack, chemically cured paint). Then the solvent and hardener chemicals in the clear will leach down into the base coat and chemically combine them into a single unit, so they won’t be able to separate.

8. Hubcaps will want to get straightened and polished. Any recommendations for that? Where to send them?
 

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Spiritofx, Steve and I are 2 nutty and passionate individuals that enjoy doing the best work humanly possible and restoring what we enjoy, especially PMC's, is therapy to us. Helping people such as you on a forum, gives us the satisfaction that another car will be saved and taken care of by the "next custodian". So sometimes we get testy when wrong info is offered and both of us are known to quickly correct and jump. For us there is only one way...do it once and do it right. In regard to the belt line trim, I completely forgot you had a Drophead rather than a sedan, I get caught up in providing a solution that I forget what the vehicle is and as you noticed Steve quickly jumped off his chair, slammed his fist on the workbench and corrected me. I'm ok with that, seriously. Us older guys get off track sometimes.

Now back to the program. When I stripped and painted my SWII, I did not want a metallic dark blue because the metallics due best with a clear. However, a clearcoat would give the overall car a wet look which I wanted to avoid. In a 2K process, only 2 coats are sprayed, allowing flash(drying time) between coats. The coats are thin, because your goal is color. The durability comes with the clearcoat that will be sprayed during the same session and then allowed to bake.

Whether the painter uses single or 2 stage (2K) the final is always buffed(cut) to a dull surface and then polished. It is a tedious process. I started with 2000 grit and proceeded to 3000 and then 5000. The sanders were the best made and had a 3/32 reciprocation using 3M Trizac discs. Next came the polishing and it took awhile due to the size of the car. The result is amazing and it looks like a fresh 1980 vehicle rather than a SEMA show car.

There is a firmin Wisconsin that does great stainless restoration and polishing. I have a Baldor industrial polisher setup here and enjoy polishing metal to a mirror-like finish. Unfortunately wiping the dust off creates wiping streaks, crazy I know.

The rear windows on your car may have screws under the seals, carefully take a look. Finding a suitable replacement may not be difficult. Try Replacement Parts in Georgia, I got my door and windscreen seals ther and they are perfect.

Good luck with your project. I know the road is a long one, but great therapy and worth it in the end.
 

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Hi,


Lots to answer there, but let me deal with a few albeit out of order.


I use a small BA ring spanner and have a magnet on hand as I dropped it a lot. However my hands are too big to get through the holes and also the front aerial makes it more awkward so I removed the inner wheel arches anyway. I suggest you think about it as it lets you thoroughly check and clean up the inner wheelarch lip then traet behind before reassembly after paint.


Not sure I agree at all with your comment (but I won't bully you) on the way you suggest painting as my understanding it is essential solvents are allowed to release out of the paint and this is very important and why best to build up paint in light layers so solvents inbetween each coat are allowed time to be released out. Otherwise the car can look good when done and then a week later imperfections start to appear. I am not a paint specialist but believe this is true situation and maybe why bad laquer conditions later occur. Best take advice from your paint specialist.


You don't need to put a brick in your door the idea is when replacing you can set the measurement as removed once weight of door parts all off. That way you don't fuss around on fittings and spoil the new paint.


Yes my car is claret.......a nice easy question thanks!!!!!


The fixtures are made as I said so the bonnet and boot can still swing upwards but mainly when wanting more access to get to the inner boot/bonnet surfaces and lower rear of the boot/trunk floor at the rear. Channels can be painted too but panels must be placed in their horizontal position for top coat but again brackets should lift them up and away slightly for further access to the channels.


If your bumper is fitted the same as mine there is no need to remove the side brackets as the bumper slides backward. My rubbers stayed in place but some electrical wire placed underneath to keep them away from the body then masked up before painting.


I appreciate there are many differences between years I did not know your window lower frames were chrome on brass. Mine might even be but I always thought they were stainless steel frames. I know my Lotus is chrome on brass window frames as there is a far better lustre you get with chrome albeit stainles can be polished it never quite has that deep mirror finish.


I will read a bit more of what you have written and follow up with some pictures.


Written this and just seen Wraithman posted so we will battle out any difference if any but perhaps not in front of you.


Steve
 
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