Rolls-Royce and Bentley Forums banner
1 - 20 of 37 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
77 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
So I just went to change my oil and the plug was in so tight it stripped when I went to use a small cheater bar. I recall reading on the forum that a handful of people are using oil extractor pumps. I'm considering getting one and I'm curious what you guys are using or if you have any suggestions on what to get. Also curious if these things get out as much oil as opening up the plug and letting it drain for 30 minutes.

Is this the sort of thing where quality matters? I've never had any luck with the smaller pumps but I'm assuming it's a different story for the big boys because why else would someone shell out $100 for one. I'm leaning toward the EWK Patented 6.5L Pnuematic/Manual Oil Extractor Pump both for the price point and the ability to hook up an air compressor. Any thoughts on brand / other considerations to bear in mind that aren't occurring to me?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,178 Posts
One must consider the internal baffles in the sump and the ability...or not to thoroughly suck up most of the oil. To be clear...the plug threads are stripped or the head socket. If it is the head socket, one can nudge the edge with a pneumatic chisel. It will definitely come off.
The likely cause for overtightening was no new sealing washer used or pure stupidity....sometimes both. The torque required to seal the plug is not great at all.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
77 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 ·
It's the head socket that's stripped. Or whatever one would call it on a hex bolt. Not the threads.

So you don't think an oil extractor pump is a good solution due to internal baffles?

Sent from my Pixel 6 using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,178 Posts
No. Your mechanic can remove the sump plug with an air chisel along the edge of the plug. Make sure you have a replacement with a new seal to replace the old one.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,178 Posts
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,321 Posts
As an aside, what are you using in your effort to remove the plug?

Since you refer to a cheater bar, I am presuming you're using some standard hex head socket. These plugs are not any one of the standard sizes (though I think it's 14mm that you can grind down, slightly and get it to work).

The tool in the toolkit often succeeds where other things fail, and that's why it exists. British Tool Works also makes a machined stainless equivalent of the Brittool hex tool for those who cannot bring themselves to use the one supplied in the original tool kit. [@Wraithman literally posted the link to the replacement plug seconds before I typed "chisel" at the end of the next paragraph. Here's the link to the tool I made reference to: Multi-Tool UR14388 | britishtoolworks]

And unless the thing is in really, really incredibly tight, it's often possible to grab the knurled edges of the plug with a very large set of adjustable pliers and get it out. You just want to be very careful not to keep trying and trying and stripping all the knurling off. It will either work pretty much straightaway or you'll have to use an air chisel.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
77 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 ·
@guyslp , yes I was using a standard hex bit. Seemed a pretty close fit. If it weren't on so tight I think it would have been fine. Did not occur to me I should google how to change the oil on this thing. Strange decision to require a non-standard tool for such a common job.

This sucker is on there crazy tight. I hammered a slightly too large torx bit into it, let the car cool and tried again. No dice. It's pretty much fully knackered at this point. I tried adjustable pliers, but I don't think it's possible to get the force necessary with those.

I'm thinking I may get my buddy to help me weld on a more standard bolt. That's the only way I see this thing coming out. Unfortunately he's out of town for another week
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
77 Posts
Discussion Starter · #10 ·
@Wraithman , I don't own an air compressor but I've been thinking about getting one. Have you guys really just chiseled these things off? It seems like the head will come off but the threads will still be in there. Or am I not envisioning this correctly? Taking an air chisel to the Bentley does sound boss though. That's more in line with a Jeep fix (get out the sawzall and hold my beer, boys).

The other thing I may try once the new sump plugs get in is dremeling out a slot in it and using a large flathead bit. But if y'all are saying the air chisel will definitely work, it would be a nice excuse to get an air compressor.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,321 Posts
I would try the air chisel/zip gun first. But also remember that you can safely (if you don't go crazy) use a torch to heat the sump plug, let it cool, and do this for several cycles. The plug itself and the pan are different metals that expand and contract differentially when heated, and doing this will often allow some very recalcitrant threaded fasteners to be removed.

You're not aiming for red hot or to "boil the oil" in the sump. But heating/cooling to break the grip of frozen threaded fasteners, and particularly when two different metals are involved, can sometimes work very well.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,178 Posts
You are over complicating this. First you are not chiseling off the head of the sump plug. You are putting the chisel at the edge and forcing it to unscrew. The pulsing of the chisel is more than you can achieve with a hammer and cold chisel. Forget trying to cut a slot as well. When the new sump plug arrives with a sealing washer, you simply tighten so it's snug. There is no pressure behind it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,321 Posts
First you are not chiseling off the head of the sump plug. You are putting the chisel at the edge and forcing it to unscrew.
This deserves to be repeated.

I also have to say that your observation about "overcomplicating things" (which is generally hard to do at times with RR vehicles) has exhibited a big uptick in these parts in recent days.

It is far better to take it slow, and to present a situation, then listen to proposed solutions, rather than charging ahead and taking actions that are almost certain to result in damage and regret.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,618 Posts
If you're going to chisel this, I would suggest farming the job out to a mechanic. Air chisels can hop around and if you put a hole in the pan, you're going to need to get a new pan. Something that can easily happen if you're not used to handling an air chisel.

Personally, I like to suck the oil out of the pan. The car takes about 12 quarts so how much oil is going to be left in there, even with baffles.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,321 Posts
I recently had to chisel an exhaust nut off a stud on my 944.
Not that the situation was caused by anything you did, or didn't do, but I really hope you used a tiny bit of anti-seize when you put everything back together.

As far as I'm concerned, this stuff is God's gift to anyone who ever has to touch a threaded connection months to many, many years after it was initially tightened with enough torque to hold it together (and nothing more).

For things that have set torque tightening figures, I tend to back off by about 5%, as anti-seize lubricant does make the tightening itself easier and you get the stretch on the fastener threads at slightly less torque than is needed on an unlubricated fastener. It's that stretch, and each element in the connection "grasping each other" from that stretch, that holds things together and keeps them that way. More is not better and, in fact, often results in the ugly battles such as the ones described in this very topic.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,178 Posts
One reason to use brass nuts was to prevent rust weld. The bras and steel would also expand at different rates and would rarely be an issue.
If using steel nuts a hi-temp antiseize (copper based) would be the choice.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,321 Posts
The bras and steel would also expand at different rates and would rarely be an issue.
Even though I know what you say is true, so is, "An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure."

At one time the prevention I had in mind did not exist, and it takes way less than an ounce of it to have it work its magic.

I'll always use it on any threaded fasteners so that should they ever need to be separated, the probability that they can be with (relative) ease is higher. I never expect properly torqued connections to come apart "by accident."
 
1 - 20 of 37 Posts
Top